Please note : The language used is of a colourful natural.

*** Now talking in #terrafusion
*** Topic is 'It's 11 am --- that's not too early to be in #terrafusion, is it??? ---- D'oh Shamb it is *not* ;)'
*** Set by Gonzo on Sat May 15 11:26:28
<Paul> i've decided that q3test2 is turd
<Paul>  thats my professional opinion
<Shambler> paul, do tell why???
<Paul> its just not a fun map to play
<Preacher> right on
<Shambler> oh right
<halakar|sleeping> q3test2 rocks.
<Preacher> oh, I thought you meant q3test in general
<[UNR]SPoG> im impressed by the details and funky looks of the q3test maps, but the layout and architecture are pants
<Paul> bouncing all over the place is really annoying
<cyBeAr> there's nothing wrong with q3test2
<Paul> theres nothing right about it
<[UNR]SPoG> its cool
<Vigilante> there is something seriously wrong with q3test in general, 'cuz i haven't been able to play it!
<[UNR]SPoG> i like it
<halakar|sleeping> q3test2 is fun
<halakar|sleeping> i beat the shit out of lpb's on it
<Paul> really...
<Shambler> turd!
<Vigilante> and that's *MY* unprofessional opinion
<Preacher> trying to merge the q2 and q1 community while making it friendly for newbies can only result in crap
<Paul> you must have been playing a different map then...
<Paul> exactly Preach
<Shambler> turd!
<Vigilante> anyone speak french in here?
<Paul> non
<[UNR]SPoG> preach - theyre not bothered about the qw/q2 communites
<cyBeAr> oui
<[UNR]SPoG> theyre not trying to appease us by making it like QW/Q2
<Paul> grande biere
<Paul> or something
<cyBeAr> no I can't speak french
<Preacher> the q1/q2 thing isnt the issue
<Vigilante> whatever, gotta go recharge my electrical... thingies which work instead of my brains
<Shambler> trying to merge the q2 and q1 community while making it friendly for newbies can only result in a game preacher and paul don't like...
<Preacher> the point is id can't make good gameplay decisions
<Paul> no shamb you get me wrong
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<Paul> i like the way it plays
<Paul> but q3test2 is a crap map
<Shambler> okay
<Paul> play the quake version of it
<cyBeAr> that is a crap map
<Shambler> ignore the paul bit then - but you did agree with preachs assertion
<halakar|sleeping> q3test2 rocks all ass
<Paul> yes.. i did
<cyBeAr> can't you set something like cl_mouseaccel in q1?
<Preacher> so far I've seen none of people I know are excellent q1 or q2 players actually love q3
<Paul> thats true
<Paul> the majority of servers are full of crap players
<Preacher> the regular moron will love q3 just because it's a new game from id with more eyecandy
<Paul> its very easy to get up the scoreboard
<cyBeAr>  the majority of servers has a couple of ~20 oingers that lives on lowpingers
<Paul> example : unreal. nice looks, plays like crap (in DM)
<cyBeAr>  example :quake. nice looks, plays terrific (in DM)
<Paul> doesn't look that good
<Paul> play the software version...
<cyBeAr> hehe
<Preacher> we all know the top players will optimize the crap out of the engine anyway :)
<Preacher> have you seen someone playing a map using mip_cap, fov_120  fullbright skins  and whatnot, it's horrible
<cyBeAr> the strange thing with q3a is that the framrate hardly change with resulotion
<Paul> probably because the the timing for it is screwed
<Paul> i get about 30 average but its smooth
<[UNR]SPoG> <Preacher> the regular moron will love q3 just because it's a new game from id with more eyecandy
<[UNR]SPoG> hey, that must be why i like it
<Paul> it drops down and it still fine
<Paul> makes no sense
<[UNR]SPoG> im a hardcore q2 player (as it were)
<[UNR]SPoG> UNR are sposed to be the best UK Q2 clan...
<[UNR]SPoG> and we all like Q3...
<[UNR]SPoG> strange
<cyBeAr> I get between 20 and 100
<Paul> never heard of them =)
<Paul> but thats probably because i have little interest in q2
<[UNR]SPoG> heh, i cant help your ignorance :)
<Preacher> well, if you like q2 for starters ...
<Paul> that would probably help
<[UNR]SPoG> if you are willing to be reasonably flexible about gameplay issues, Q3 is fine
<[UNR]SPoG> theres no "right" and "wrong" when it comes to gameplay issues
<Preacher> flexible?
<Preacher> there is better and worse
<cyBeAr> blabla ballalbllablalblblablabbablalbala
<Preacher> more skill and less
<cyBeAr> cya
<[UNR]SPoG> theres just what youre used to, opposed to what youre not
<Shambler> spog, i'm sure you must be a "regular moron" too :P
<Paul> you either enjoy it or you don't
<[UNR]SPoG> ya shambler
<Preacher> no
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<[UNR]SPoG> preach i have not heard ONE SINGLE decent argument about what is a BAD gameplay issue
<[UNR]SPoG> in q3test
<Preacher> since you're view are biased you're unfit to judge what a "decent" argument is
<Paul> ouch
<Paul> do you enjoy playing it preach and Spog
<Shambler> hehe it's #wankyq3atestarguments
<[UNR]SPoG> heh, i could say the same about you, but at least i'm trying to see it from as balanced a POV as possible
<[UNR]SPoG> im talking about q2 players' arguments
*** Retrieving #terrafusion info...
<[UNR]SPoG> theyre crap too
<Shambler> mortal combat & mario brothers on crack.
<Shambler> Old skool is going to bail on this.
<Shambler> newbs & kids will love it, anyone can get frags hell shoot you can't miss.
<Shambler> when did graphics & flash replace superior gameplay at id?
<Preacher> backpacks are an excellent example IMO
<Shambler> (sorry, copied from a random post at the pq forums)
*** Paul changes topic to 'Welcome to #wankyq3testarguments! Spam at you own will.'
<Preacher> which adds a whole dimension to teamplay and gameplay to, id's reason for removing them are not clear and it's definitively not adding anything
<Shambler> hehe nice one paul
<Preacher> adding to gameplay should always come before change
<[UNR]SPoG> um
<[UNR]SPoG> backpacks
<[UNR]SPoG> removing them weakens the winner of a fight
<[UNR]SPoG> making it easier for the newly spawned guy to kill him
<Preacher> the entire design philosophy behind q3 is aimed towards casual players and newbies
<[UNR]SPoG> making it more fun for the person being shot
<Paul> yea[
<Preacher> and id is expecting everyone else to adapt to it
<Paul> yeap
<[UNR]SPoG> seems good to me
<Preacher> does that add as much as backpacks does to teamplay?
<Preacher> no
<Shambler> yeah preach, stop whinging and adapt to it...
<Paul> id are after a share in the market
<Paul> they are making a game which geared toward multiplayer
<[UNR]SPoG> anything that makes it more balanced and fun for EVERYONE (newbies are at least as important as any "leet" players)
<[UNR]SPoG> is good
<Paul> it has to be aimed at the biggest possible audience
<Shambler> sp0g, amen to that
<[UNR]SPoG> the backpacks argument is 100% opinion
<Preacher> if they want to make a game aimed at newbies fine, but making it adapted to hardcore players wouldn't be difficult to support also
<[UNR]SPoG> i think teamplay is great without them
<Paul> so some things have to be changed
*** Shambler changes topic to 'Welcome to #elitism - Q3A should be for hardcore players only, fuck the newbies!!!'
<Paul> ha Shamb
<Paul> nice =)
<[UNR]SPoG> like, i really dislike you treating newbies as scum
<Paul> who Spog?
<[UNR]SPoG> preacher
<Paul> ah ok
<[UNR]SPoG> like, theyre not important at all
<Preacher> whatever you might say q3 will never live as long as q1 in it's current state, nor let ppl come to a level of skill as q1 currently is at
<Preacher> newbies aren't scum
<[UNR]SPoG> "skill" is a meaningless word when it comes to games like this
<Preacher> but you shouldnt only cater towards them
<Preacher> make an easy/advanced mode, it would be as simple as that
<Shambler> preacher, the skill thing is only because q1 has a head start
<Paul> i'm just wondering how my comment about a map being turd has come to this
<Shambler> turd!!!
<[UNR]SPoG> hehe
<Paul> turd is great word
<[UNR]SPoG> indeed
<Preacher> skill thing is because q1 allowed for great skill'
<Paul> was it intentional though?
<[UNR]SPoG> skill is not easily definable
<Preacher> no
<[UNR]SPoG> its a matter of opinion
<Paul> did id make quake with skill in mind?
<Preacher> part of it maybe
<Paul> rjumping wasn't part of their plan
<Preacher> if q1 was such a luckshoot perhaps they should try to learn from it except trying to get away from it
<[UNR]SPoG> and you can argue that one thing takes more skill than another infinitely long...
<Shambler> hehe, q2 and q3a will allow for great skill, all it needs is for people to try
<Preacher> no
<Paul> different type of skill maybe?
<Preacher> if the controls aren't there, you don't have as many options
<[UNR]SPoG> yeah paul
<Preacher> driving a car with your feet would be a different skill to , that doesnt mean it would be fun
<[UNR]SPoG> but preach, you seem to be looking at it from a very narrow perspective...
<Shambler> you have more weapons, more maps, different power ups - ergo, more options
<Preacher> no
<Shambler> you definitely have waaay more options in q2
<[UNR]SPoG> "if it aint a Q1 feature its not a valid feature"
<Preacher> only as long as each weapon , map and powerup adds to gameplay , and does not take away from it
<[UNR]SPoG> Qw peeps have had longer to come up with analogies too, its not fair ;P
<Preacher> you shouldn't dillute gameplay to much, less is more
<Paul> Spog: hehe yeap
<[UNR]SPoG> thing is
<[UNR]SPoG> all analogies are innacurate
<[UNR]SPoG> by definition... ;P
<Preacher> you're the one saying that, not I
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<Paul> at the end of day it comes down to one thing
<[UNR]SPoG> preach - Q3test works great, and its only got a few weaps....
<Paul> do you enjoy playing it?
<Paul> if you don't
<Paul> don't play it
<Paul> its only a game
<Preacher> it doesn't work great
<[UNR]SPoG> absolutely
<Preacher> why shouldnt we fight for a good game?
<Paul> ok yes you can fight for a good game
<Shambler> at the end of day it comes down to one thing --- is it exactly the same as Q1??? If not, dismiss it immediately...
<[UNR]SPoG> because your opinion of a good game is just that
<[UNR]SPoG> your opinion
<Preacher> Shambler: saying that only shows how narrow minded *you* are
<Paul> but what you like might not be what everyone else likes
<Shambler> hehehe that was sarcasm you f00!!!!
<[UNR]SPoG> hes saying thats the impression he gets from you preach
<Preacher> and you can't blame everything at being an opinion just because you can't meet the arguments
<Shambler> of course *I* don't think that way
<[UNR]SPoG> how can it show him to be narrow minded?
<[UNR]SPoG> preach
<Paul> ok i'm off to kill some newbies
<[UNR]SPoG> the arguments can go on for infinitely long
<Preacher> because he thinks that any complaint at q3 only is derived from q1 players wanting it to be exactly like q1
<[UNR]SPoG> i could argue that the grenade launcher takes mroe skill to use than the RL, because its harder to kill people with
<Shambler> isn't it???
<Shambler> damn, i must have missed something
* Shambler doesn't give a flying fuck about q3a...but he does find the bitching funny :P
<[UNR]SPoG> i culd argue that playing with your feet takes moer skill
<Preacher> we want it to be more like q1 in some aspects because q1 had better gameplay
<[UNR]SPoG> i could take typing lessons
<Paul> Spog : the hard bit is trying to hit the Return key with yah big toe
<Paul> took me a while to get that
<Shambler> man shit, i should try that
<Shambler> fhh kg ju
<Shambler> hmmm
<Shambler> that was typing with my feet
<Shambler> maybe i wont try to play with them after all...
<[UNR]SPoG> might not increase your score...
*** [UNR]SPoG sets mode: +o Preacher
<[UNR]SPoG> the my game is better than your game argument can go on forever - unless both sides are willing to get rid of their limited perspectives
<Shambler> hehe well with my scores, it might imrpove :P
<Preacher> bye.
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<[UNR]SPoG> ive been arguing the opposite side to preacher just for the sake of it...
<[UNR]SPoG> the UK Qw/Q2 community has had the argument for centuries...
<[UNR]SPoG> or, ever since q2 came out and the qw players didnt like it
<[UNR]SPoG> they judged q2 before they even had the test
<[UNR]SPoG> they judged q3 on the previews and the IHV
<Shambler> yeah
<[UNR]SPoG> so the only game theyve ever had a chance to get good at and enjoy to the full is QW...
<Shambler> i liked both q1 and q2 for dm myself
<Shambler> i had no problem with either one
<[UNR]SPoG> it really is their loss...
<Shambler> they were different games, had different virtues and flaws, and i liked them both
<[UNR]SPoG> i liked both
<[UNR]SPoG> i liked sonic the hedgehog...
<[UNR]SPoG> but it should have had backpacks dammit#
<Paul> not too keen on q2
<Paul> but i don't get annoyed about it
<Paul> i just don't play it
<[UNR]SPoG> fair enough
<Shambler> hehehe spog
<Shambler> yeah fuck and the sonic rockets were waaaay too slow :P
<Paul> hahahha
<Paul> ok
<[UNR]SPoG> ive been enjoying playing a few of the QWers in Q3test...
<Paul> nice chatting to yah
<[UNR]SPoG> but now they all seem to have given up on it...
<[UNR]SPoG> cya paul...
<Shambler> by paul
<Shambler> bye even
<[UNR]SPoG> hehe
<Paul> bye all
*** Disconnected